2555: Alternative Facts

[dannyhatch]

with Alingon Mitra – Chemda is sick; enduring racism; Alingon’s Harvard degrees; Trump’s inauguration numbers and his response to accurate reporting; does Donald Trump like having haters?; Maine governor's constant racism; The Million Women March; punching Nazis

Guest:
Alingon Mitra



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[Dean from Australia]

Sooo...what do we reckon - Is America headed towards a second civil war?

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Apia

They live in Ohio or Louisiana.

i know you mean the Mid-West and the South, and you're correct, but Louisiana feels like an odd pick. it's a very specific, mysterious, and beloved brand of South and most people when besmirching the region don't often go with la maison du gros facile. might i suggest Arkansas? 'cause, c'mon, fuck Arkansas.

[Dean from Australia]

Originally Posted by Apia

You know your country better.
I picked it because of this podcast

Hidden brain

Episode 59: The Deep Story
In the months since the presidential election, many have noted that lots of Americans live in bubbles — echo chambers filled with the voices of people who mostly agree with us. Sociologist Arlie Hochschild felt this long before the rise of Donald Trump, and five years ago she went on a mission to understand the other side. She left her own liberal bubble in Berkeley, California for a conservative one, deep in the Louisiana bayou.

Great call on that podcast Apia. Fascinating insights in this episode.

[Sparrow]

so we should sit back, downplay, and be thankful as we watch a century of progress unravel? the private prison system /is/ modern day slavery. it affects a disproportionate member of our minority populations. their loss of freedom is profit. the school to prison pipeline gets 'em early. i wonder who they'll get to build that wall for no pay? but, they're not shucking and jiving on a plantation, so golly, things must be awesome! buck up!

the Trump regime in no way resembles anything close to a liberal heaven even by comparison. it's a direct threat to our democracy, our land, and our people. it's damn serious and, coming from a German, i would hope you'd understand more than most.

[Sparrow]

i agree. the 18th century was a different time, but for that time, the American Experiment was a hella radical thing to do and we've pushed and pushed to expand the ideals of Freedom to more and more of our people in more and more arenas. this recent sharp reversal, which isn't unexpected considering backlash occurs like clockwork and Capitalism reaching its natural end cycle was always going to suck balls (-isms tend to play out nasty at their ends), is pretty fucked up to be living through. especially those of us raised with the promise of a "big bright future" stewarded by our parents and grandparents.

"something terrible happened to me, so it's the worst time EVER! "

something terrible /has/ happened. this makes it sound like we're whining.

[dannyhatch]

Originally Posted by Apia

Danny, I already told Rosa on facebook, I'm not so much into this RIP democracy 1776 -2016
Stuff.

Things were much worse 1776. Only white, male landowners were allowed to vote, so maybe only 4% of the population.
Black people were not even considered fully human by than. No good old times there. There was slavery. Even the trump regime seems like liberal heaven compared to those times.
Imagine a black person with this slogan on the shirt or banner.
Seems strange to me.
I know you are a good person and so is Rosa.
But this seems more like "something terrible happened to me, so it's the worst time EVER! "

I can't speak for the woman who made the sign and very kindly gave it to us, but I interpret it as a comment on the fact that nobody seems to care about the numerous instances of tampering with the 2016 presidential election. Of course I don't think things are as bad now as they were then. I know I personally am a very lucky individual. But I agree with the broad point the sign is making, while understanding that the sign is not meant to be taken literally.

[Bucho]

Trump doesn't "love" having haters per se, but he loves the shit out of the fact those haters perform the role of being easy targets for the tweets by which he can bathe in an invigourating rush of love as literally babillions of his supporters mash the heart button in his direction.

[Dean from Australia]

Governments around the world are trying desperately to recalibrate their relationship with the Trump administration and are finding themselves unsure of what the fuck to do.

Our conservative government here in Australia is beholden to a particularly virulent strain of right wing extremism that are licking at the boots of the Trump White House while more moderate elements are shitting themselves. For example, they've been scrambling to salvage something out of the aborted TPP and the ridiculous thing about that is, even after Trump killed it the other day, our dickhead PM and his trade minister were running around telling everyone "It's not dead. It's not dead."

Our media here treat Trump like some constant punch line to a bad joke and every story is like "Let's see what Trump is gonna say next. It's like, they're treating him like some precocious scally wag who is all bravado without malice. "Don't worry people, he'll become the benevolent statesman - you'll see." - even as he's signing those orders to take away your rights.

Meanwhile, citizens everywhere are collapsing to the floor, in front of their television sets, like stunned cattle mouthing the words 'what the fuck are we in for?' through dribbling saliva.

[jcro21]

I was on Alingon's side for a bit during this episode. I think he was trying to say there's a limited upside to trying to make fun of Trump, that pointing out attendance numbers won't have much of a real impact, even if it upsets him.

But as it went on he proved to be one of these liberal types who do nothing but critique and hem and haw about strategy. It's the mindset of "this protest isn't perfect, so it's not worth doing." People like Alingon will sit on their hands hoping to find the best way to engage with fucking Nazis while they run train on our rights and our country.

He's saying all this shit about how attendance numbers and twitter feuds distract from what's really important, how movements need to have concrete actions behind them to inform people or else they're not useful. I think Chemda was absolutely right - the burden isn't just on the protestors to communicate clearly, it's also on you to fucking pay attention and read something about why millions of people took to the streets this weekend.

I lost it when he asked "So were the protests anti-trump or what?" For someone who professes to care so much about what's really happening, he seemed uninformed, and again way too eager to pick on the people who are on his side.

AND he's gonna pussyfoot around punching nazis?? Believe me, no one who saw that video is going "hm, I bet that guy who got punched the fuck out has some valid points." All punching nazis is going to do is make them scared to leave their homes, which is what they're doing to the rest of us by being nazis.